|
Post by Ex-Rockets on Apr 20, 2008 22:54:36 GMT -5
Knicks Deal:
Bobby Jackson Josh Howard Shawn Marion Knicks 2006 1st
Lakers Deal:
Elton Brand Steve Francis
I'm just curious to what GMs in LBA think of deals like this, since this is my first day here.
|
|
Magic
Role Player
Posts: 847
|
Post by Magic on Apr 20, 2008 23:05:26 GMT -5
wow, horrible deal for Lakers.
How can you trade the best player(on the lakers) on the best team in the league basically for josh howard and a bad pick. Marion has done nothing but decline in the last couple TC's, and Jackson is 30 and also declining.
Top 5 player in the league for not even one of the 2 best players on an average tean(before this trade).
IDK if this trade should go through.
JJ/Brand/Yao = scary
|
|
|
Post by Ex-Rockets on Apr 20, 2008 23:09:46 GMT -5
In my eyes, the Lakers don't get much in return. Bobby Jackson, Josh Howard, and the first seem like backups and fillers to me. Shawn Marion is a solid player, but an average starter at best. Not to mention Marion's contract is awful. So much for the new GM not screwing up the Lakers dynasty.
|
|
|
Post by Golden State Warriors on Apr 20, 2008 23:11:17 GMT -5
usually unknown new gms have to go through a week where trades have to be approved. At least I think... This maybe one deal that joe and james look at but i could be wrong.
It is indeed a completely horrible deal for them though
|
|
|
Post by Pistons on Apr 20, 2008 23:12:02 GMT -5
The Lakers get rid of Francis and his bad deal... but don't get enough back for Brand.
I think the 1 week review will be in effect here.
|
|
|
Post by danhiggins on Apr 20, 2008 23:15:52 GMT -5
The week probation period is in effect, but I don't think this gets over-turned. I think this is a win/win.
|
|
|
Post by Ex-Rockets on Apr 20, 2008 23:19:08 GMT -5
The week probation period is in effect, but I don't think this gets over-turned. I think this is a win/win. . How do the lakers win from this? They get worse, and they don't even get younger or drop contracts...Sure they lose Francis' contract, but then they get Marion's which isn't much better. Brand is a big time player, and they are literally getting backups and an average starter for a stud 24 year old. I told him Tmac could potentially be moved in a deal with Brand. How on earth does this make sense for LA? I'll usually back up a fellow duck, but this is criminal.
|
|
|
Post by Golden State Warriors on Apr 20, 2008 23:20:12 GMT -5
I don't see how taking marion's horrible contract is a win, not to mention giving up a top big man for little more than howard who's a decent player but definatly not worth brand.. at to it a crappy first and he has to give francis its a horrible deal. What happened to making a deal thats fair and a win / win knicks?
That said we'll see how it all works out, but lakers definatly could get more out of brand than this type of move IMO.
|
|
|
Post by danhiggins on Apr 20, 2008 23:23:06 GMT -5
Classic Prez. Classic.
I'm surprised anyone even cares. If a guy isn't under 25 years old no one wants him anyway.
What did you offer Prez?
|
|
|
Post by Golden State Warriors on Apr 20, 2008 23:29:50 GMT -5
I didnt offer for brand, parker or brown cause unless i was gonna give up prince or duncan (which i wasnt) its not even worth talking about.. I asked him if he like oded , battier, picks, wanted to do an MLE swap for kittles and inquired what he might be interested in for miles or ketner. He said he wasnt interested which was fine. Thats pretty much it. I agree btw on the value of players being almost nothing when they hit 26 or so its like that in a lot of leagues cause gms love to think they can win through the draft and it rarely if ever works out that way.
|
|
|
Post by Mike's Balls on Apr 20, 2008 23:32:27 GMT -5
bad trade for Lakers (Sorry higs I had to tell lthe truth). I think it should be vetoed but maybe they work something else out where Knicks give more.
|
|
|
Post by danhiggins on Apr 20, 2008 23:38:42 GMT -5
I think I'm giving up a career 15/8 SF in Marion, a very good prospect that blew up in TC in Howard, a pick (who knows where it ends up, but I HOPE it isn't very good), and Bobby Jackson.
He gives up Steve Francis and Elton Brand. He'll get just as much production out of Jackson that he was getting from Francis at a shorter/cheaper contract. Jackson can score over 20 a game without being an option.
This gives him a line-up of Kwame/Wally/Marion/Howard/Parker with subs like Ketner, George, Miles, and Jackson. He's still a very good team and is set for the future.
Brand will get about 20/12 for me. Francis is more expensive and a longer contract, but I'll miss Jackson's scoring.
Marion isn't a "back-up" as some might say. Is he T-Mac? Of course not, but he'll get 15/8 a night while shooting decent percentages. He's a starter in this league. His contract isn't "horrible" either. Too many people in here thnk if it isn't a rookie deal that it should be a one-year deal and these same people never win. Marion makes less than the max. He's not a max player, but he's not making the max. Is he worth 10 million a year? Yes.
Some may not like it, but it's done. The week probation is in effect, but like I said, this isn't a bad deal like people think. Again, I don;t think this gets overturned. I've seen worse deals go with newer Gms. If the Lakers Gm stands pat now I still think he's got a very good team and he's set for the future.
|
|
|
Post by Ex-Rockets on Apr 20, 2008 23:45:03 GMT -5
I think I'm giving up a career 15/8 SF in Marion, a very good prospect that blew up in TC in Howard, a pick (who knows where it ends up, but I HOPE it isn't very good), and Bobby Jackson. He gives up Steve Francis and Elton Brand. He'll get just as much production out of Jackson that he was getting from Francis at a shorter/cheaper contract. Jackson can score over 20 a game without being an option. This gives him a line-up of Kwame/Wally/Marion/Howard/Parker with subs like Ketner, George, Miles, and Jackson. He's still a very good team and is set for the future. Brand will get about 20/12 for me. Francis is more expensive and a longer contract, but I'll miss Jackson's scoring. Marion isn't a "back-up" as some might say. Is he T-Mac? Of course not, but he'll get 15/8 a night while shooting decent percentages. He's a starter in this league. His contract isn't "horrible" either. Too many people in here thnk if it isn't a rookie deal that it should be a one-year deal and these same people never win. Marion makes less than the max. He's not a max player, but he's not making the max. Is he worth 10 million a year? Yes. Some may not like it, but it's done. The week probation is in effect, but like I said, this isn't a bad deal like people think. Again, I don;t think this gets overturned. I've seen worse deals go with newer Gms. If the Lakers Gm stands pat now I still think he's got a very good team and he's set for the future. So a 15/8 SF with a bad contract was dealt for Elton Brand PF 24 6'8'' 254 B+ C B A A- B What do the Lakers really get out of this in the long run? Nothing. And they lose an all-star center who looks like KG with those ratings. I haven't even been in this league that long, but I know that these type of trades are absolutely silly and shouldn't go through.
|
|
|
Post by Golden State Warriors on Apr 20, 2008 23:49:12 GMT -5
Isnt the lakers already set for the future or is Brand over the hill or something at 24? Sure howard is a nice player but brand is a big man which obviously is in short supply here and howard won't be an all star ever with the sg's we have in the league. Marion has zero value as you just stated and the league knows. His B defense is a killer and his contract is basically just going to sit. Francis at least has value to teams looking for pgs or gives him more options shall he choose to deal parker, which i doubt. Where does marion play? behind wally? Miles? And why continue to play wally at PF? he did ok there scoring wise, but his defense is horrible there. I'm not even gonna get into jackson who cannot handle the ball nor play defense enough to merrit any real min..
Its not a win for the lakers at all.. perhaps had you give your 2004 pick with the deal you'd be able to sell this to the rest of the league. Frankly the lakers gm really should look around and see what he truely could get if indeed he wants to shop brand and heck if a week goes by and he's still in love with this deal perhaps you make it then.
There really hasnt been a lot of deals like this with new unproven gms so get away with that stuff. Again we'll see how it all works out but you cannot sell a big man like brand on the cheap and the league knows it.
|
|
|
Post by duncanonu on Apr 21, 2008 0:46:45 GMT -5
I stopped reading about post 6 where the Knicks said this is win/win. That is certainly not true, but that is not your fault Knicks. It's not your job to make sure the other guy is getting a good deal, it is his. However, we put the rule in place for a reason and this is case in point. This trade needs to be over-ruled under the provision we added several years back about new GM's dealing right away. An over-shooting PG, a potential future solid wing, and a slightly above average SF on a max deal, plus the Knicks 25-30th pick (after adding Brand) in 2006 is simply not anywhere near what Brand is worth in this League (of which the Lakers has no clue, hence the rule). Sorry Knicks, but this one needs to not go through.
|
|